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Post by Huw on Mar 5, 2014 13:08:22 GMT -5
Issue #123: Are Superhero Comics Killing the Industry?
Another week, another show, but this time we’re minus one podcaster as Steve steps out. This week’s topic comes from the speech that Image Comics publisher Eric Stephenson said at a ComicsPRO meeting upon accepting an award. We discuss what his comments imply, what they mean, our thoughts on them and the reactions from Dark Horse’s Mike Richardson and IDW’s Ted Adams.In the first half of the show, we talk news in the world like the talks about Wonder Woman’s movie costume, Skottie Young’s Rocket Raccoon, Batman: Arkham Knight, Paul Levitz heading over to Boom Studios and Lena Dunham upcoming Archie mini-series. And then, because we’re creatures of habit, we discuss our favourite books from the last week. Some of those books include: Royals: Masters of War, The Wake, Mighty Avengers, Lois Lane, Fantastic Four and more. So, folks, what do you all think on this rather loaded subject? This should be a matter on which pretty much every comic fan will have some sort of opinion, so make yourselves heard right here!
Also, what does everyone think of Bob's (pretty awesome, in my opinion) idea of a Gotham City Sirens/Birds of Prey game? How would you like to see that game presented and what characters would you include?
Have your say about anything and everything mentioned in this weeks show in this thread.
Annnnnnnnnnd… we say it on the show, but just in case you missed it, the Talking Comics crew on Twitter are: Bobby: @bobbyshortle Steve: @dead_anchoress Stephanie: @ hellocookieAnd Bob’s email is bobreyer@talkingcomicbooks.com
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Post by joroak on Mar 5, 2014 14:02:35 GMT -5
I said it to the crew on twitter, but I'll say it again here. I thought this was the best episode the crew has put together. The debate at the start of the second half was really good. You guys disagreed at times and hearing that conversation was really enlightening. I wish Steve was there so we could have gotten his points on it. I hope that more debates break out naturally.
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Post by pacino on Mar 5, 2014 14:14:42 GMT -5
Stephenson blaming people for buying 'bad books' is faily lame, and that's what it seemed he was doing. He was also pointing out licensed comics as 'not the real thing' that won't grow the industry. Readers do not care about the industry, by and large, they care about content. If they want to read a license, they will. I would say most people started off reading comics through a license, or from watching a TV show or movie based on superhero comics (and those TV shows/movies would not be the 'real thing' according to Stephenson). I also read X-Files. That counts as a sale and everything to my retailer! Comics don't have to be hipster-cool approved in order to put money into the register.
he's also incredibly disengenous when he says he wants LCSs to make money and not Walmart/amazon, etc. That's not true, come on. The more places comics are, the better they will do, and the better LCSs will actually do, too.
Besides Saga and Walking Dead, everything else from Image largelly sits on the shelf beyond a #1. They do their own 'relaunch' every 4-6 months with tons of new #1s. They don't have the same IPs, so people don't get on them about it, but they still do it.
In the end, read what you want. I say that as someone who largelly reads indie stuff, along with Marvel. Belittling other stuff as 'bad comics' is a foolhardy strategy to appeal yourself to all involved. He talks about diversifying readership, but castigates people based on what they read.
Finally, 60% of the direct market is still DC/Marvel, Comixology is dominated by DC/Marvel titles, and bookscan is dominated by Walking Dead, Saga, DC and manga titles. Oh, and KIDS books. Because they do read, but don't make up a large part of the Wednesday crowd.
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Post by Huw on Mar 5, 2014 14:33:51 GMT -5
I said it to the crew on twitter, but I'll say it again here. I thought this was the best episode the crew has put together. The debate at the start of the second half was really good. You guys disagreed at times and hearing that conversation was really enlightening. I wish Steve was there so we could have gotten his points on it. I hope that more debates break out naturally. I totally agree, dude. This was a brilliant debate to listen to and credit to Stephanie for encouraging it to take a positive turn, add some balance (regardless of what you agree with) and have both sides spoken for. Hopefully we'll hear from Steve on this matter, I'm very interested to know what his thoughts are. As always, the passion for the industry from the TC crew came through loud and clear. This one is debate that most of us could easily talk about for hours on end.
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Post by joestate on Mar 5, 2014 14:49:52 GMT -5
I agree that it was interesting, but I feel it got too emotional and that Stephanie may have taken it personal. It seemed like her tone dropped because she was "visibly" upset with the way the rest of the team was handling the coverage of the speech. I don't want to give the impression, I really REALLY enjoy Stephanie on the podcast and don't want to discourage her from speaking her mind or having her opinions. It just felt kind of awkward to me once that happened.
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Post by hellocookie on Mar 5, 2014 14:56:52 GMT -5
I agree that it was interesting, but I feel it got too emotional and that Stephanie may have taken it personal. It seemed like her tone dropped because she was "visibly" upset with the way the rest of the team was handling the coverage of the speech. I don't want to give the impression, I really REALLY enjoy Stephanie on the podcast and don't want to discourage her from speaking her mind or having her opinions. It just felt kind of awkward to me once that happened. Honestly, I WAS really uncomfortable with the turn the show took. I was under the impression that we weren't directly talking about the speech and we were going to talk about the points and what they mean for the industry etc. It really threw me off when the negativity just started pouring in because, as I said in the show, I didn't feel that way towards the speech. It wasn't that I took it personally, but I just felt like there was SO MANY good points that Stephenson brought up and we spent almost half an hour focusing on the bad points of it. Maybe it's because we started with the negative before getting to the positive, but I just wasn't on board with that. There was a moment where I thought about backing out for the remainder of the conversation. I adore Bob and Bobby but yeah, it got a bit hard for me to want to talk about it more after a certain point.
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Post by Huw on Mar 5, 2014 15:03:49 GMT -5
With regards to the subject of retailers:
When I was 18 and doing my GNVQ (a post high school qualification you can do in schools in the UK) I had to do a feasibility study for a new business. My idea was for a comic book store called 'AAW Comics', or All Are Welcome Comics. Essentially its ethos would, as a reaction to bad experiences in a few comic shops, revolve heavily around customer service and increasing dwell time in the store. Basically, the store would commit to helping any customer who was new to comics, by asking them questions about what they wanted in a comic and make recommendations based on what the customer says. This would be offset, and make the customer hopefully more prepared to buy, by offering the customer the chance to bring the book back and exchange it for another if they did not find it to their liking (possibly not a viable business practice looking back!). Every customer, if they needed it, would be given all the time by the staff that they needed to get whatever they set out to buy. These commitments would be made obvious to the customers with posters etc. so customers could see that's what to expect as soon as they entered. Essentially, anyone and everyone who enters the store would be made to feel welcomed and get high quality service that would hopefully bring repeat business and also new customers via word of mouth. Increase in dwell time would be hopefully achieved with an in-house coffee shop, something that UK comic shops don't have (not that I've seen, anyway!)
Retail is a service led industry and comic book stores that have an offish and snobbish nature towards the people who spend money with them, have caused a wave of bad press for comics. Shops have become tarred with that brush, even if they aren't of that nature, and making a customer feel valued really isn't a complicated thing to do.
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Post by thephantomwelshman on Mar 5, 2014 16:55:19 GMT -5
Comic shops to the newcomer are quite intimidating. I've only got into comics within the last year, about a year ago my knowledge was Marvel, DC, Alan Moore, Sandman, and Sin City. I picked up my initial trades through Waterstones and WHSmith (mainstream book stores in the UK), it wasn't until I'd read a couple of Batman, Wonderwoman and Batwoman trades I decided to take the plunge and visit my LCS. Luckily my LCS couldn't have been more welcoming and helpful, but I guess the fact that my first port of call to get into comics, wasn't an actual comic shop speaks volumes about the general reputation of shops. If it wasn't for picking up Superhero titles from a high street store, I wouldn't have been lead eventually to the like of Image, Darkhorse, IDW, etc, at the same time, it's bit of a double edged sword, as I know a lot of friends when I talk at them about the likes of East of West, Saga, and Pretty Deadly, knowing that they would love them, the usual response is 'oh, I wouldn't know where to start with comics' due the perception of all the big issue numbers associated with the big two.
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lumpkin
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Posts: 32
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Post by lumpkin on Mar 5, 2014 18:12:38 GMT -5
I felt "emotional" taking over a conversation ( witch was great and well thought out on ALL points ) everyone started tiptoeing after that point. People's views were being expressed, then pushed aside after the meltdown. Even if the point is negative it's his\her point and we want to hear it. why we get to miss out on views because people get " emotional" is a bummer. ( switched directions of topic ) Everyone is thought provoking and you have a great balance on the show. But something felt off after … maybe I'm the only one who felt this . Maybe I'm just old. Please don't take any word choices as an insult or attack. I love the show and all of you are Fantastic! … kisses xoxo 
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Post by Bob Reyer on Mar 5, 2014 19:23:45 GMT -5
I felt "emotional" taking over a conversation ( witch was great and well thought out on ALL points ) everyone started tiptoeing after that point. People's views were being expressed, then pushed aside after the meltdown. Even if the point is negative it's his\her point and we want to hear it. why we get to miss out on views because people get " emotional" is a bummer. ( switched directions of topic ) Everyone is thought provoking and you have a great balance on the show. But something felt off after … maybe I'm the only one who felt this . Maybe I'm just old. Please don't take any word choices as an insult or attack. I love the show and all of you are Fantastic! … kisses xoxo  Willie, (or more properly, Don!), First off, I certainly respect your feelings, and your more-than-constructive criticism regarding our latest podcast! We truly appreciate your feedback, and thanks for that "thought-provoking"--it's what we strive for! As to our latest effort, things went a bit awry as our initial intent was not to discuss Mr. Stephenson's speech as such, but the ideas about the industry's future contained within. Stephanie was certainly correct in pulling me back on-topic, as we had gone around the metaphoric block with our opinions, and any pull-back after that was more about respecting our disagreements rather than continuing to re-address the same points. I'm sure that you'll get to hear many more heated debates in the future, and with any luck, they'll have you unable to decide who's "right"! Thanks again for being an involved listener! Bob
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lumpkin
Fearless Defender
Posts: 32
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Post by lumpkin on Mar 5, 2014 22:21:39 GMT -5
I felt "emotional" taking over a conversation ( witch was great and well thought out on ALL points ) everyone started tiptoeing after that point. People's views were being expressed, then pushed aside after the meltdown. Even if the point is negative it's his\her point and we want to hear it. why we get to miss out on views because people get " emotional" is a bummer. ( switched directions of topic ) Everyone is thought provoking and you have a great balance on the show. But something felt off after … maybe I'm the only one who felt this . Maybe I'm just old. Please don't take any word choices as an insult or attack. I love the show and all of you are Fantastic! … kisses xoxo  Willie, (or more properly, Don!), First off, I certainly respect your feelings, and your more-than-constructive criticism regarding our latest podcast! We truly appreciate your feedback, and thanks for that "thought-provoking"--it's what we strive for! As to our latest effort, things went a bit awry as our initial intent was not to discuss Mr. Stephenson's speech as such, but the ideas about the industry's future contained within. Stephanie was certainly correct in pulling me back on-topic, as we had gone around the metaphoric block with our opinions, and any pull-back after that was more about respecting our disagreements rather than continuing to re-address the same points. I'm sure that you'll get to hear many more heated debates in the future, and with any luck, they'll have you unable to decide who's "right"! Thanks again for being an involved listener! Bob
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lumpkin
Fearless Defender
Posts: 32
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Post by lumpkin on Mar 5, 2014 22:27:59 GMT -5
Bob, funny thing I was more on Stephanie's side of the discussion. There's been a lot of attacks at his comments ( via social media ) I wanted to hear that side of thinking. So I can understand that side of view. That's all. 
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Post by Nick on Mar 5, 2014 22:52:16 GMT -5
I loved the emotion in the 2nd half of today's podcast. Both Bobbie and Stephanie were great -- they clashed, but respected each other enough to be honest about their feelings and thoughts. Stephanie was hurt. I think she felt almost betrayed or lost -- at least that's what I got from her voice. And Bobbie did a great job of standing his (logical) ground -- yet in the end I think he too was hurt...once he realized how he inadvertently hurt his friend.
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Post by Nick on Mar 5, 2014 22:58:31 GMT -5
My favorite part of the show was the discussion about comic book shops. I was amazed to hear about the awesome shops in Toronto and New York. I think it would be a great idea to have annual awards for comic shops, with awards for such things as "best store layout," "best in-store promotion," "best customer service," "most unique," "most kid-friendly," etc. etc.
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ry
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Posts: 10
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Post by ry on Mar 6, 2014 10:47:45 GMT -5
I too loved the emotion of the podcast, made it seem real and showed they aren't afraid to talk about anything!! on a side note, the big comic book shop around me really don't seem to like new customers, i don't know why. They sure took my money though  Here is my story... When the 52 started, I decided to start collecting again. I wanted one of the variants (just loved the cover too much to pass) so when I bought my comics for the week, I put a deposit down to get the variant. Went to go pick it up and they gave the book away to a "regular" who didn't put a deposit down because they weren't sure I would pick it up. WHAT!? i put a deposit down. I could have become a regular. Went to another shop, found a great, fun shop, but they are closing in about a week now. very sad. went back to comixology when they announced the closure of the other store.
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