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Post by pacino on Jul 7, 2016 14:42:48 GMT -5
I felt you guys were very negative about the coming Marvel books. It's funny that some never want to see things change while others hate any change you make. They can't win.
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Post by Bob Reyer on Jul 7, 2016 15:54:17 GMT -5
I felt you guys were very negative about the coming Marvel books. It's funny that some never want to see things change while others hate any change you make. They can't win. Chris, My position on the new Marvel mirrors in many ways what my feelings were about DC's "New 52", so they're very conflicted. While I'm certainly behind any diversification effort, it's hard to be completely positive when the stories told are so against the old-fashioned "heroic model". Beyond that, I find it an odd business model when the leads from mega-hit movies don't appear in the comics, whether due to being a different iteration of the character, or through off-model actions of the once-classic heroes. Here's a pitch that Marvel won't touch, a variant of one I threw out during "New 52" debates. What about having "Marvel Now!" be the current versions of these characters (mixed in with whatever "evergreens" you might want!), and then starting a line of "Marvel Classic", maybe a half-dozen titles centered on the iconic versions of the best-of-the-best, and while I'm dreaming, let's have veteran creators who know how to tell epic "event stories" in 2 or 3 issues as the driving force behind them--John Byrne on Fantastic Four, George Perez on Avengers, Chris Claremont and Alan Davis on X-Men...a boy can dream, can't he?
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Post by Bob Reyer on Jul 7, 2016 17:34:39 GMT -5
Haven't listened to the podcast yet, but i'm sure Doctor Mara will do a great job as the new host! Was shocked last week though when i heard Bobby was leaving the show, never would've expected that! Dave, You must check back in with what I'm sure will be a stellar review of Our Doctor Wood's job at keeping us reprobates in line!
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Post by bluemeanie on Jul 13, 2016 23:00:17 GMT -5
I felt you guys were very negative about the coming Marvel books. It's funny that some never want to see things change while others hate any change you make. They can't win. Here's a pitch that Marvel won't touch, a variant of one I threw out during "New 52" debates. What about having "Marvel Now!" be the current versions of these characters (mixed in with whatever "evergreens" you might want!), and then starting a line of "Marvel Classic", maybe a half-dozen titles centered on the iconic versions of the best-of-the-best, and while I'm dreaming, let's have veteran creators who know how to tell epic "event stories" in 2 or 3 issues as the driving force behind them--John Byrne on Fantastic Four, George Perez on Avengers, Chris Claremont and Alan Davis on X-Men...a boy can dream, can't he? I completely agree with the suggestion of a line of Marvel and DC Classics. As an older reader I have felt that both Marvel and DC are completely ignoring what basically got them to where they are as far as publishing is concerned. It's not about the stories it's about how they can adapt these characters for TV and Movies...because that makes them $$$$$ It's unfortunate that "Bean Counters" have taken control of both companies. There are so many things wrong with the "Big 2" that I don't know where to begin. The really big shame of what Marvel is doing right now is that they are doing what DC just tried to do and failed miserably at with the "New 52" Killing off major characters. Making Cap a agent of Hydra. Iron Man is now no longer Tony Stark but is now a woman. Where does it end? I know of a lot of people that are disgusted with all this crap that both companies are pulling for the sake of making money. The sad thing is that there are 2 books that Marvel has put out recently that I am really enjoying and I have heard rumors that Marvel is basically going to "Blow Up" the whole universe AGAIN. Does this mean that Dr Strange and Spidey are going to start over AGAIN??!!?? A classic line for both companies would be great. There are sooooo many artists/writers/creators that are still viable that can't get regular work. It's AGEISM at its worst. Here are a few that can still draw/create: Walt Simonson Jerry Ordway Rich Buckler Bob Layton Terry Austin John Byrne Roy Thomas George Perez Jim Starlin Ron Frenz Steve Lightle Frank Brunner Ron Wilson Sal Buscema Mike Grell Ron Randall There are many more that I haven't listed...but I think everyone gets the gist. These guys can still crank out at least one book each per month...and they know how to tell a story both with words and the actions in their art. It's very doable...it's just not cost effective to the little "Bean Counters" that have taken over the big 2. Maybe there needs to be a petition started and sent to both companies. I don't know anymore...the only thing I do know is that Marvel and DC will not be getting any of my money anymore if this keeps up.
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Post by megamaramon on Jul 14, 2016 18:14:49 GMT -5
Here's a pitch that Marvel won't touch, a variant of one I threw out during "New 52" debates. What about having "Marvel Now!" be the current versions of these characters (mixed in with whatever "evergreens" you might want!), and then starting a line of "Marvel Classic", maybe a half-dozen titles centered on the iconic versions of the best-of-the-best, and while I'm dreaming, let's have veteran creators who know how to tell epic "event stories" in 2 or 3 issues as the driving force behind them--John Byrne on Fantastic Four, George Perez on Avengers, Chris Claremont and Alan Davis on X-Men...a boy can dream, can't he? I completely agree with the suggestion of a line of Marvel and DC Classics. As an older reader I have felt that both Marvel and DC are completely ignoring what basically got them to where they are as far as publishing is concerned. It's not about the stories it's about how they can adapt these characters for TV and Movies...because that makes them $$$$$ It's unfortunate that "Bean Counters" have taken control of both companies. There are so many things wrong with the "Big 2" that I don't know where to begin. The really big shame of what Marvel is doing right now is that they are doing what DC just tried to do and failed miserably at with the "New 52" Killing off major characters. Making Cap a agent of Hydra. Iron Man is now no longer Tony Stark but is now a woman. Where does it end? I know of a lot of people that are disgusted with all this crap that both companies are pulling for the sake of making money. The sad thing is that there are 2 books that Marvel has put out recently that I am really enjoying and I have heard rumors that Marvel is basically going to "Blow Up" the whole universe AGAIN. Does this mean that Dr Strange and Spidey are going to start over AGAIN??!!?? A classic line for both companies would be great. There are sooooo many artists/writers/creators that are still viable that can't get regular work. It's AGEISM at its worst. Here are a few that can still draw/create: Walt Simonson Jerry Ordway Rich Buckler Bob Layton Terry Austin John Byrne Roy Thomas George Perez Jim Starlin Ron Frenz Steve Lightle Frank Brunner Ron Wilson Sal Buscema Mike Grell Ron Randall There are many more that I haven't listed...but I think everyone gets the gist. These guys can still crank out at least one book each per month...and they know how to tell a story both with words and the actions in their art. It's very doable...it's just not cost effective to the little "Bean Counters" that have taken over the big 2. Maybe there needs to be a petition started and sent to both companies. I don't know anymore...the only thing I do know is that Marvel and DC will not be getting any of my money anymore if this keeps up. I didn't know how much I wanted a "Marvel Classics" line until y'all brought it up. Even if it was a limited run, put out alongside whatever is going on right now, it would be incredible and remind folks of the legacy of the creators in an era where things get restarted over...and over...and over...
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Post by Bob Reyer on Jul 15, 2016 5:01:38 GMT -5
Friends,
For my money, having a "Classic" imprint that would feature the characters in their iconic iteration as an entry-way for new readers driven to actual comics from the films is a great addition to the publishing line, and with little risk involved, as it shouldn't affect the sales of the newly-relaunched versions, but might actually increase them, as new eyes would be inside the comic shops! Having been drawn to read an Avengers title featuring the classic line-up, a young girl or boy might be fascinated by the idea of Jane Foster as Thor or the Miles Morales Spider-Man, and become hooked. If Marvel can print up thousands of copies of 112 titles a month, 6-to-10 extra books by creators who would bring those characters "back-to-basics" and enhance the line is hardly a huge capital outlay, and undoubtedly a no-lose proposition; after all, look at the positive energy DC has created for their "Rebirth" attempt at restoring equilibrium.
ps) Mara, having read so many older books for your research and "Legendary Runs" show, you're getting into those different and more economical (if wordy!) story-telling rhythms that marked that era, and I don't doubt that other young people, given the opportunity, would find that "sweet spot", particularly if the stories feature characters that they are already familiar with!
pps) Rob, that's a great list of creators, and if I had the money to start a company, those names would be a great way to fill the talent roster!
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Post by bluemeanie on Jul 15, 2016 13:42:14 GMT -5
Bob, Don't know if you are on facebook...but I did post a question/thread over on the Back Issue facebook page about the "Classics Line" idea. If you want the link to see the discussion let me know. There is already a discussion about it over on the Mego Museum in the comic book section. There are a lot of older readers such as ourselves that have been not happy with the current directions that the Big 2 have taken in the last 10 years. Thanks for getting this ball rollin'. I'd really like to get a petition started and see if DC and Marvel really LISTEN to their ultimate consumers. If you have any ideas of getting that started let me know. I'm all in
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Post by Bob Reyer on Jul 16, 2016 10:31:24 GMT -5
Bob, Don't know if you are on facebook...but I did post a question/thread over on the Back Issue facebook page about the "Classics Line" idea. If you want the link to see the discussion let me know. There is already a discussion about it over on the Mego Museum in the comic book section. There are a lot of older readers such as ourselves that have been not happy with the current directions that the Big 2 have taken in the last 10 years. Thanks for getting this ball rollin'. I'd really like to get a petition started and see if DC and Marvel really LISTEN to their ultimate consumers. If you have any ideas of getting that started let me know. I'm all in Rob, I did sneak a peek at those threads, and it's nice to see that my crazy idea has some adherents! Thanks!
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Post by bluemeanie on Jul 16, 2016 16:32:27 GMT -5
Oh it does. Unfortunately like every thread it's started to go off in other tangents...although there are a lot that are sticking to the topic at hand. Here's the last thing I will post on it here and it's something for anyone that is reading here to really think about:
I'd like to point out that DC has been doing "Key Book" or "Essential Book" reprints at $1 each. Same goes for Marvel and the same goes for Image that started the trend of essential/key books reprints. If they can do those for $1 they could sure as hell make a "Classic" line in the same vein. You tell me that they couldn't take a "Flyer" on a Classic line of comics done the way the $1 books are done??!!??
Here's something else to chew on about how doable this idea is : How many variant covers does Marvel and DC do a month? You tell me if they stop the insanity with variant covers they couldn't take that money and do a year test run on a "Classics" line??!!?? The only people that are really raking in boat loads of money on the variants are not the publishers but the secondary market. Marvel and DC still ONLY get paid the price on the book which is the same price as the regular cover. Again, what these companies are doing is a "Quick" fix with whatever they are publishing. What I find laughable is that all the newer collectors/store owners/people in the industry brag about how June was the "Biggest sales month EVER in the history of the industry." REALLY??!!?? How did they come up with that??!!?? Is it based on monetary sales or is it based on print run? I'm betting it's based on monetary sales...in fact I'd bet the farm on that one. Print Runs are DOWN from the last 20 years or so. It's a fact. I think the companies keep the print runs down on purpose so the Collectors/Speculators buy that second print because it has a different cover. This whole concept of having a "Classics" line is very doable if Marvel and DC want to still be actual PUBLISHERS of comic books...but it seems all they care about are licensing agreements and movie and TV deals. If that is truly what they want then they should stop all the shenanigans of destroying these characters that we've loved for so many years.
It is very doable if both companies want to salvage what has been lost...especially with older readership that is tired of games/shenanigans.
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Post by toxicsooner on Jul 18, 2016 21:46:25 GMT -5
I've been less active, but it's less about reading books and more about life and how I read books now (more trades & digital). My kids getting older an has more stuff going on... I've found it more difficult to stay engaged with a forum that was at one time and to a certain extent still is my primary source for new books. Speaking of which, Bob, I just pre-ordered my copies of "Lady Killer, vol. 2" 1 & 2... I'm seriously stoked for this. I can't wait to see Josie's story continue!
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Post by Bob Reyer on Jul 21, 2016 6:21:55 GMT -5
I've been less active, but it's less about reading books and more about life and how I read books now (more trades & digital). My kids getting older an has more stuff going on... I've found it more difficult to stay engaged with a forum that was at one time and to a certain extent still is my primary source for new books. Speaking of which, Bob, I just pre-ordered my copies of "Lady Killer, vol. 2" 1 & 2... I'm seriously stoked for this. I can't wait to see Josie's story continue! Jason, I completely understand, as one's life finds its own level and balance in all things! I'm also very excited about the new volume of Joelle Jones' Lady Killer, I'm hoping that we can have Ms. Jones back on the podcast somewhere in the middle of the new run!
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Post by bluemeanie on Jul 23, 2016 14:04:12 GMT -5
Bob, I know that you are a big fan of the British TV Series The Avengers. Been picking up the VHS Boxed sets and came across one of the Emma Peel sets today at a thrift store and it has a mail away card for a free poster. It came with the '67 Set. Any idea, or do you have, said free poster? Thanks.
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Post by toxicsooner on Jul 23, 2016 22:20:22 GMT -5
I've been less active, but it's less about reading books and more about life and how I read books now (more trades & digital). My kids getting older an has more stuff going on... I've found it more difficult to stay engaged with a forum that was at one time and to a certain extent still is my primary source for new books. Speaking of which, Bob, I just pre-ordered my copies of "Lady Killer, vol. 2" 1 & 2... I'm seriously stoked for this. I can't wait to see Josie's story continue! Jason, I completely understand, as one's life finds its own level and balance in all things! I'm also very excited about the new volume of Joelle Jones' Lady Killer, I'm hoping that we can have Ms. Jones back on the podcast somewhere in the middle of the new run!v I look forward to hearing Ms. Jones talk about her transition from part time writer and full time artist to full time as both on this volume. It is always cool to hear from creators as they take on this challenge. Her art is second to none and I know she took on the writing duties in the later part of vol. 1 so I'm confident this series will be great. I encourage anyone who hasn't read this to give it a shot, you will not be disappointed.
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Post by ComicNerd101 on Aug 4, 2016 12:28:52 GMT -5
You guys HAVE to check out this new artistic series from LA Photographer Duke Shoman!!! "Photographer Duke Shoman has taken the idea of the private lives of our heroes and has created the breathtaking and poignant SUbPAR HEROES, a 10-piece art collection, which portrays some of the most well-known fictional heroes in very human situations." moviepilot.com/posts/4008740
www.dukeshoman.com
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Post by Scott Honig on Aug 8, 2016 20:53:13 GMT -5
Bob,
Again, a great job tonight discussing the evolution of the female hero in comics! As always, you are informative and entertaining. And no technology mishaps! It was great to put the face to the voice, as it was with Bobby, Steve, and Joey, who were all sitting right behind me. I hope to run into you again at Fourth World, NYCC, or somewhere else.
Scott Honig
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