Chapin
Agent of S.H.I.E.L.D.
Posts: 67 
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Post by Chapin on Aug 27, 2014 8:02:25 GMT -5
... but trying to look at it as a bottom line discussion. Ha ha ha ... you said "bottom line."
Yeah, I'm with you all. And Jezebel really said it best. "Marvel, you should know better."
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Post by courtneyk on Aug 27, 2014 9:41:00 GMT -5
Thanks for taking the time to discuss, Bob! I think this cover is even more inappropriate when you compare it to a cover that Manara did for a European comic called "El Clic" (Click), which I won't post a link to here but can easily be Googled. Side-by-side comparisons of the two covers show them to be pretty identical. And if Tom Brevoort's comments on the situation are any indication ("It’s also, for a Manara piece, one of the less sexualized ones, at least to my eye."), this is sadly not something that Marvel sees as a problem. Once again, it's a variant cover so most people will have to seek this out to get it, but it's creating quite a negative stigma for a new female-led book from Marvel, and that's unfortunate. John (and Courtney, Cap'n Nick, Joe, Tony, "icecream"...) It's never a problem, particularly on this subject, which everyone knows is one of my pet peeves! We nearly discussed this on-air last episode, but all the chips hadn't fallen yet; I'm sure we'll get to it this week! Back in the Nineties, Marvel was as guilty as anyone regarding objectification, as they chased the "Image audience" with broke-back artwork and "Marvel Swimsuit Editions". They've made much progress of late, so the choice of Mr. Manara seems a back-slide, and Mr. Breevort's comments aren't helping; perhaps a simple "Sorry, we made a mistake" type of statement would have been better? As has been pointed out here (and by me to the Zenescope guest we had on years ago!), what audience are you cultivating with a cover such as this, and isn't that approach antithetical to the one created by the character and story within the book? I'm sure they will sell a few more copies, but I'll bet they have already made some potential buyers leery, despite the statements from writer Dennis Hopeless about his intentions on the series. ("I can promise you we have no intention of blatantly sexualizing any of the characters in our story...you have my word that our story treats Jess with the utmost respect.") Mr. Manara has a long history of successful work in his chosen field, but a Spider-Woman cover is not the place for it...in my opinion. Hi Bob,I appreciated hearing your thoughts on the podcast today, and agree with all of you. Dennis Hopeless's response has made me more positive about the book - and as I said before, I am a fan of his and planned on checking this out based on that - but I know I had some comics-reading friends who were already leery based on Greg Land being on the book, and this cover has just turned them off completely. It's a shame. |
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colicab
Fearless Defender
FC4
Posts: 12
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Post by colicab on Aug 28, 2014 1:57:34 GMT -5
Man... Such a bad cover. I cannot imagine liking it even if I was into that sort of sexualized thing. Just terrible proportions.
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Post by WiccanBeyond on Aug 31, 2014 3:22:06 GMT -5
Not really getting the upset over this cover. It's not like Mr. Manara hasn't been doing work like this for Marvel variants for quite some time, particularly in Marvel Now. He even did a whole series called X-Women (here's a link to some of his Marvel images: marvel.com/images/gallery/creator/9146/images_featuring_milo_manara#0-961298 ). With regards to the complaints about the sexualization of a character, I fall in the Alan Moore camp. A character that is void of sexuality is an incomplete character. I just wish it was more balanced. I would love to have my "Boys of Marvel" Calendar, at this point I am gonna have to commission twelve different comic artist to do some super-chickencake for me (not as bulky as beefcake). Here's an interview with Axel Alonso, Marvel's Editor-in-Chief: www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=55190My fear, with regards to the tone that some of this discussion can take is that we will end of with writers and artist siding so heavily on the side of sensitivity that we will end up with comic book covers that come with trigger warnings or worse that are censored. I don't know. The last thing I want is censorship. |
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Post by pacino on Sept 24, 2014 7:53:22 GMT -5
They cancelled the Thor #2 variant for some dumb reason. That thing was beautiful.  |
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Post by rgsc on Oct 4, 2014 9:49:42 GMT -5
They cancelled some of his variants but I've heard conflicting things about the SpiderWoman variant - is this trainwreck still being put out?
I am curious about reading the character but not sure about the Land art. Can anyone recommend some older series that I should read to get introduced to Jessica Drew?
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Post by Bob Reyer on Oct 4, 2014 20:46:21 GMT -5
They cancelled some of his variants but I've heard conflicting things about the SpiderWoman variant - is this trainwreck still being put out? I am curious about reading the character but not sure about the Land art. Can anyone recommend some older series that I should read to get introduced to Jessica Drew? "R", Of course, the original late-Seventies incarnation that began in Marvel Spotlight #32 before Jessica jumped into her own series would be my first thought, but I will say that...(well, promise that you won't tell anyone that I told you this) but Brian Michael Bendis did two good runs on the character, Spider-Woman: Origin and Spider-Woman: Agent of Sword that set up her current situation, and Kelly Sue DeConnick's Avengers Assemble run that began with issue #9 of that title and running through the #25 finale had some fabulous moments for Ms. Drew! Hope this helped, Bob ps) I think that the Manara variant Spider-Woman is still being released, sadly. rrr |
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Post by rgsc on Oct 5, 2014 12:10:06 GMT -5
They cancelled some of his variants but I've heard conflicting things about the SpiderWoman variant - is this trainwreck still being put out? I am curious about reading the character but not sure about the Land art. Can anyone recommend some older series that I should read to get introduced to Jessica Drew? "R", Of course, the original late-Seventies incarnation that began in Marvel Spotlight #32 before Jessica jumped into her own series would be my first thought, but I will say that...(well, promise that you won't tell anyone that I told you this) but Brian Michael Bendis did two good runs on the character, Spider-Woman: Origin and Spider-Woman: Agent of Sword that set up her current situation, and Kelly Sue DeConnick's Avengers Assemble run that began with issue #9 of that title and running through the #25 finale had some fabulous moments for Ms. Drew! Hope this helped, Bob ps) I think that the Manara variant Spider-Woman is still being released, sadly. rrr Thanks Bob! Much appreciated. I will see if those are available on MarvelUnlimited. I actually have KSD's Avengers Assemble run but haven't gotten around to reading it. To the top of the pile it goes! And I'll keep your BMB recommendation just between us  Rodney PS. add a "g" to the start your initials for my reaction to that....But they cancelled the rather nice Thor cover? Marvel, what are you thinking?? |
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