Talking Comics Podcast 02/04/15

So glad to hear you talk about Death Vigil and Stjepan Sejic today. I'm hoping that 2015 is the breakout year for both comic and creator.

Steph, we see eye-to-eye 99% of the time or better in terms of what you put out there on the show; I often feel like you and Bob are essentially my avatars in most of the TC discussions, that's how often I agree with you, but wow, that was some really strong blame-gaming in the middle of this episode re: buying books in singles. And it represents a massive 180` flip from the tune you guys were all singing a couple of months back when you were discussing Peter David's trade-wait-blaming comments on the cancellation of X-Factor (I seem to remember something along the lines of "Hey, Peter, don't blame your fans maybe? The people who are reading and buying your book? If the book gets cancelled, then maybe it just wasn't good enough, ok").

I love Gotham Academy, I buy it in singles, but that's a personal choice and preference in terms of how I want to digest that story, and if I were trade-waiting it wouldn't make me any less of a fan of that book, or any more responsible for its fate, and to suggest otherwise is really severe, and a little bit messed up if i'm being honest. You want to blame someone for The Movement or any other cancelled book, blame the brass at DC, or the marketing department, or people who illegally upload or download in lieu of ever actually buying it; telling fans that they're responsible for a book going away because they chose to buy it in trade instead of giving in to the buying-in-singles culture is really harsh, to say the least. What if they don't count digital, or they didn't count digital until recently? Would you blame people that only read through digital in the same way? I know it's frustrating to see low sales numbers for a book you love, and i'm as worried about the fate of Gotham Academy as you are, it's a phenomenal book, get the word out, tell your friends, yes, but lashing out at fellow fans is misplaced, and it plays right into the hands of that certain section of the industry that wants to remain firmly rooted in the models of yesteryear instead of moving forward towards the future of the medium. Buying in trade *IS* supporting the book, you now own a copy of it, you have just spent hard-earned monies on it, it's on your shelf, and if DC or Marvel don't currently count that or recognize that, then the onus is on them.

Don't be a trade-wait-shamer. Not even once.

Otherwise, great episode, as always!

he has my vote already.  I had never heard of him until Sunstone came out, and now I see his name popping up everywhere.

I had read about the Peter David thing as a fan of X-Factor, and commenters got deep into throwing blame around.  In that particular instance I think it came down to people's interpretations of Mr David's words that got everyone fired up.  While I'm no industry insider, everything I've read leads me to believe that if a book isn't selling month to month it is more likely to get cancelled.  I think over the last couple months people have become more aware of this, hence the big turnaround on the show this week.   I was as surprised as anyone to hear the gang going on about how fans need to be buying the monthly book if they want it to stick around (I heard a lot of "I'll wait for the trade" on this show over the last 6 months or so) and I think that is just the effect of learning more about how the business works.  This is not to say trade-waiters are evil or need to be shamed.  they have very valid reasons for getting books in trades instead of monthlies.  buying the book in any form is better than not buying it at all.

where I got lost was in all the hype around gotham academy.  is it really that good that it should be pushed this hard?  for a second there I wondered if DC was sending a little donation to patreon (just teasing)  seriously though, and I may become something of a pariah for saying it, but it is possible that if the sales for GA aren't great and it is potentially on the chopping block then perhaps it's not as great as it seems or at least doesn't resonate with as many people as some like to think it should (I liked issue 1 and thought the series had a lot of potential but wound up dumping it after issue 3; it just wasn't growing on me even though I loved the art).  I loved X-Factor but it seems obvious now I was in a distinct minority who thought it was a good book, otherwise it would be seeing more issues instead of stopping abruptly at issue 20 (what kind of ending was that, anyway?!).  The movement is another great comparison, because i have heard people sing its praises for months now, but when I checked it out (actually bought both trades) I wound up actually disappointed and could see, at least from my perspective, why it was cancelled: it had a lot of potential and had a ridiculously diverse cast but it felt poorly written (shallow plots, not much in the way of world building) and the whole thing felt like it was developed by a focus group.  Again, if people weren't buying it, maybe it didn't resonate with as many people as some thought it would.  Anyway, the discussion about hashtags and buying 5 copies of the book just to make sure it keeps going (semi-artificial sales) seemed very "pushy salesman" and didn't feel like the talking comics gang whose opinions I have come to respect and love listening to.

but, to finish out "not on a downer" I am loving the Sejic attention and that the door is swinging both ways and us fans of the show are finding books to suggest to you as opposed to the other way around (Steve in particular has had a couple home run suggestions for me and Bob has had a couple home runs for my daughter).  I had no idea who the guy was until Sunstone came out and I checked it out as a novelty, but his art and writing style hooked me and now death vigil is at the top of my list and I will be likely delving into rat queens soon as well.

I think you all bring up some good points. We of course feel those books, Gotham Academy and The Movement, were worth pushing because of their quality. But quality is a subjective topic of course and if you don't feel strongly about something you shouldn't support it.

I think our point was more to call on those who do love it to try and expose it to as many people as possible. I think most of us buy books we aren't enjoying or ones we never read and the idea of doubling down on your support for one you love is not a bad way to spend a few bucks. But that doesn't end at Gotham Academy it goes for everything. If we all shared some of our love of this medium with others (whether it be Batman, Saga, Daredevil, Avengers etc.) we would see a a healthier industry.

There is no shame in trade waiting at all (which I do all the time) but it is a financial reality that the big two look more at month to month sales than the trade sales. So, if you love something that's in danger your dollars would go further to saving it if spent issue to issue.

But let's make no mistake your actual financial well being is more important than Gotham Academy getting a longer run. Someone's buying habits are their own and I will never fault anyone for how they choose to spend their hard earned dollars.

Benedikt,

As some of my favorites are falling victim to either "The Curse" or event-related injuries, if I'm to have something to talk about on-air, there are going to be some wild cards, and thanks to you folks on the Forum, I've discovered Death Vigil and the work of Stjepan Sejic. I'll have to wait until May for the trade on that one, but it will be worth the wait for some of the extras it's sure to include.

As to Gotham Academy, you've identified one of the main problems in creating a broader readership and marketplace, and while the book doesn't grab you particularly, I'm thrilled that you still appreciate why we feel the need to beat the drums for titles such as Gotham Academy and Ms. Marvel. 

Danke Schoen!

I have found it very hard to get adult non-comic readers to get into comics, even when I deliberately find stuff that has their names written all over it. I'm not sure why, but that's just how it goes. My wife is a huge Arrow fan, but didn't care for the comic. She is also a huge Firefly fan, didn't really enjoy leaves on the wind. I suggest titles I know she would enjoy, but she just doesn't have enough interest to actually pick them up (leading the horse to water, etc.). I handed Planteary to a friend of mine for whom it should have been totally his kind of thing, and he came away saying, "eh, that was okay" and has expressed no further interest in comics.

on the other hand, I have talked to some kids about comics and they are all about checking them out every time I make a suggestion. the best thing the industry can do is to take some of the titles that used to appeal to your teens and tweens, of whom the non-comic readers seem to be more receptive to trying comics out. I mean I go to my daughter's school and there are a ton of kids who like iron man, wolverine, the hulk, thor and so on, but if you look at the comics those characters are in you will find very few stories that would be understandable or content-friendly to 3rd-5th graders. I just read about wolverine drowning his own son and while I was always a fan of wolvie, there is no way I would want the son-killing assassin version of him to be the one my kids become fans of.

perhaps this is part of the secret wars thing this summer, particularly with the X-Men 92 stuff. Saturday morning cartoon versions of the X-Men would make those characters way easier to market to younger kids or for parents and freiends to give to kids who wouldn't otherwise have tried comics...